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Thread: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

  1. #1
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    Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Ive just viewed the SCOTTISH WAR MEMORIALS PROJECT website - Dundee & Angus - Civic Memorials to see pics of the Mains Parish War Memorial in the CAIRD PARK , DUNDEE covered in painted grafitti of vandals and this memorial is of course owned and maintained by the Dundee Council as it would appear that the Central Government gives money to Councils for this maintenance.

    Apart from the vandalised graffitti by Vandals of the Parish the council don't seem to have been maintaining it well as there are bits of names that have decayed or damaged over the years since 1922 when it was unveiled .

    The Scottish War Memorials Project website also records that the Scotsman dated 22 May 1922 has this entry:

    Memorial Fountain at Dundee :

    Lt Col J B Muir DSO, , Commanding Officer of 4/5Bn The Black Watch on Saturday unveiled the Mains War Memorial fountain erected in Caird Park, Dundee .

    The Memorial bears the names of 25 Men of the Parish who fell in the War . After the Ceremony Baillie Gillies accepted custody of the Memorial on behalf of the Corporation .

    The Scottish War Memorials Project shows photographs of the vandalised War Memorial and the front showing this

    Erected in Memory of the Men of Mains Parish who made their Supreme sacrifice 1914-1918 has graffitti over it in paint and the names section on the next part has other paint and Graffitti on it . The name section the memorial has missing names on the stonework .

    Is this Memorial out of sight and should it be moved to a safer location or what ? The Lord Provost of Dundee who was in the save the Black Watch campaign should now be notified via the media of this grim story

  2. #2
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    This is terrible Pat, Dundee council should be taken to task for this,
    nellie

  3. #3
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Got tae agree with ye there nellie but also they hiv nae respect fit any wan or anything gae them a tooth brush & dina stop till it,s back tae whit it was when unveiled
    sandy

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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    photos of the Vanadalised war memorial that is hidden in the shrubs area but nearto the car park is to be added to this Pats corner .

    Photos are supplied and reproduced here with the permission of Mark Duffy, who found the damage to the memorial when researching it!

    <span style="font-size: 14pt">1.


    <span style="font-size: 14pt">2.


    <span style="font-size: 14pt">3.


    <span style="font-size: 14pt">4.


    <span style="font-size: 14pt">5.


    The Scottish War Memorials Project

  5. #5
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

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    <span style="font-family: verdana; font-weight: 700; font-size: 24px; color: #000080; letter-spacing: normal">
    Outcry over defaced Black Watch memorial<span style="border-collapse: separate; color: #000080; font-family: verdana; font-size: 24px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: bold; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0" class="Apple-style-span">

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    Monday 20

    <span style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: verdana; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: bold; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0">
    April, 2009 - 21.35

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    <font size="1" color="#626262">Source: </font>
    <font size="1" color="#800000">Dundee Courier
    </font><font size="1" color="#626262">Weblink:
    </font>
    <font face="Verdana" size="1">
    <a href="http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2009/04/21/newsstory12991535t0.asp">
    http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2009/04/21/newsstory12991535t0.asp</a></font>
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    <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: times new roman; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 5px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 5px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0">
    <font class="bodybold" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em; font-weight: bold" size="2">
    FORMER SOLDIERS and members of the Black Watch Association last night
    condemned the defacement of a war memorial in Caird Park, Dundee, as
    “despicable.”</font>


    </p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Unveiled by Lieutenant-Colonel JB Muir, commanding 4/5th Battalion The
    Black Watch, the sandstone fountain was erected in 1922, and bears the
    names of 25 servicemen from Mains Parish who fell in the first world
    war.</font></p>

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    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    The memorial today stands daubed with juvenile slogans and the names of
    the perpetrators, branded as “scum” on one war memorial internet forum.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Pictures of the graffitied fountain posted on the War Memorial Scotland
    website over the weekend have provoked horrified comments.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    The remarks from ex-soldiers are united in their condemnation of the
    vandalism that includes paint spatters, marker pen and even the chipping
    away of sections of the original names. Some of the graffiti is dated as
    far back as 2005.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Former soldier “Spoons” from St John’s Town of Dalry said, “This is
    truly awful and shows that some education is needed in the local schools
    as well as some serious work done to make good the damage.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Adam Brown from Sutherland, said, “Does Dundee City Council have no
    shame? It looks like they have completely given up on this memorial.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    David McNay from Lanarkshire said, “I would suggest the corporation and
    therefore the council have failed in their duty here.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    A writer from Forfar added, “I heard that the councils in the UK get
    money from the central government for maintenance of their war
    memorials.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    “Seems if that is fact then they do little maintenance.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Lord Provost John Letford last night promised to look into the matter
    and make sure the situation is remedied as soon as possible.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    He said, “I wasn’t aware of this previously but it’s sick and
    unacceptable. These memorials are important to this city and it is quite
    disgraceful that anyone would stoop to such lengths to desecrate them.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    A spokesman for Dundee City Council said, “We have received complaints
    about the memorial and we will investigate.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Bob Paterson, chairman of the Tayside branch of the Western Front
    Association, said last night, “This memorial has to be restored by the
    council as it is a major part of our local heritage. We also feel that
    the memorial after restoration should be moved to a far more prominent
    location where more people can see it.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    “I know money is a problem. However the Tayside branch of the WFA will
    be delighted to work with the council or whoever to get this memorial up
    to standard—a standard which many Black Watch men gave their lives for.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    Major Ronnie Proctor, secretary of the Black Watch Association, said, “I
    think that people who desecrate war memorials are very low and don’t
    realise that men and women actually gave up their lives so we can walk
    around free.</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    “I really think it’s despicable. They ought to realise the sacrifices of
    these men for our freedom.”</font></p>



    <font class="body" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: 1.3em" size="2">
    The website group plan to lobby the council’s leisure department and
    have notified other websites and blogs to rally support.</font></p>

    <p class="MsoNormal"><span class="Apple-style-span"><font size="1">
    <font class="body">
    <span style="font-family: Verdana; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); line-height: normal; border-collapse: separate; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 5px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 5px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px">
    :: click
    weblink for full article</font></font></p>



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  6. #6
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Quote:Lord Provost John Letford last night promised to look into the matter and make sure the situation is remedied as soon as possible.

    He said, “I wasn’t aware of this previously but it’s sick and unacceptable. These memorials are important to this city and it is quite disgraceful that anyone would stoop to such lengths to desecrate them.”

    The state of Caird Park was brought to John Letford's attention in September 2005. The date written on the Memorial on one of the photo's is 2005.

    Evening Telegraph

    More images are on the Scottish War Memorials Project site. I don't know if you can view without registering.

    The Scottish War Memorials Project

  7. #7
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Hiya lads
    hay has anywan got lettfords email adress if so ki i hae it a i wil certanly remind him when this was brought tae his attention a wee reminder winna go wrong as bumpy wid say the barsteward sorry m8
    sandy

  8. #8
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Thanks Chalky and thanks also to Mark Duffy for the pics of the vanadalised war memorial and it is now wilful neglect on the part of Dundee City council as they have failed in their duties as caretakers of the war memorial to repair and maintain it over the years and especially having been informed of its state in 2005 . The council ( Corporation ) ( viz Baillie Gillies ) accepted the war memorial into the care and custody of the Council at the ceremony in May 1922 .

    I see that I have been mentioned in todays Courier as a writer on the Scottish War Memorials website from Forfar ! Fame at last ...

    You do not have to be a registered member of the Scottish War Memorials Project to view the information..

  9. #9
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    Good on ye Pat,if anything needs fixing,you are the man and capable of upsetting people who are not doing their job.
    Suppose we will now see some action on this memorial

  10. #10
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    Re: Caird Park War Memorial Dundee & vandals

    It widnae tak a brain surgeon tae find the culprits. They wrote their bloody names! Not very bright this generation.

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