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Thread: WW1 Black Watch NCO photo

  1. #1
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    WW1 Black Watch NCO photo

    Can anyone help me with the personnel and their unit in this WW1 photo.
    My wife’s great grandfather Thomas Jack (rear-centre) originally servedin the 9th Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders in the Ypres area but at some stage got transferred to an unknown unit of the Black Watch, given the cap badge in this photo.
    Thanks
    Will Duncan
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  2. #2
    Administrator Chalky's Avatar
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    Hi Will and welcome to the Black Watch Forum.

    There are a couple or more guys that will hopefully tell you about the photo.

    A Lieutenant and 6 Sergeants is a strange group photo.

    The Lt is certainly wearing BW Collar Dogs but the Sgts aren't

  3. #3
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    Hi Will.

    It looks prewar to me.

    The belts are 1903 pattern except the Sgt sitting at right (with no collar badges) who has the 1888 introduced Slade Wallace belt.

    What was his reg. no. in the Argylls?

    Cheers,
    Derek.

  4. #4
    Senior Member ronmarsden's Avatar
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    Hi Will,
    I agree with Derek, a pre war photo. Think those upright tunic collars were phased out around 1913?
    Chalky I believe Sgts are wearing small 1897 pattern St.Andrew collars. Pics below.

  5. #5
    Administrator Chalky's Avatar
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    Thanks Ron,

    I would need a microscope to see them.

  6. #6
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    Thanks everyone for taking an interest in this photo.
    Rankin-2-Thomas-Jack.jpg
    Thomas Jack was born in 1884
    There is no family memory of service before WW1 but the attached posed photo where he is wearing the Argyll & Sutherland uniform was taken by J Nasiruddin at 10 Maquis Street, Calcutta (photo mount enscription).
    He lived in Kirkintilloch so I assumed he joined the 9th A&SH and that given he was a private, then possibly a corporal in the A&SH in Ypres (see below) so I assumed that he reached the rank of sergeant in the BW subsequently but your uniform evidence seems to now contradict this theory?

    I also found a photo of him (I think) as a member of the Staff of "C" Company 9th Argyll & Sutherland : 8th Oct 1915 at Chateau des Trios Tours (now called Kast drie Torens , located west of Brielen, NW of Ypres on road to Elverdinge - Thomas Jack I believe is back row on the left hand end where he is a Corporal
    unspecified.jpg
    Although there are a lot of Thomas Jack’s with WW1 medal cards, I assumed this was his card given his A&SH connection Thomas Jack medal vard.jpg
    I could not find his service record so I assume it has been destroyed in WW2.

  7. #7
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    Will,

    The Thomas Jack associated with that medal card was not in a theatre of operations before January 1916 at the earliest, otherwise he'd have been awarded the 1914 or 1914-15 star, which he was not.

    3021 Pte. Thomas Jack served abroad first in the 9th A&SH, but was at some point transferred to the 10th Bn where he underwent his number change to S/40652.
    At a later stage he was transferred to the 6th Bn. This detail comes from the medal roll associate with his medal card.

    Photos show him as a Cpl in the Argylls then a Sgt in the Black Watch.
    So as the B.W. photo is prewar then presumably so is the earlier ranked one of him in the A&SH.

    Being born 1884 he would be around typical joining up age of 18 in 1902. Interestingly the 2nd Btn A&SH were stationed in Calcutta in 1902.

    Cheers,
    Derek.

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