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Thread: Pipe Majors 4/5th Bn after WW2

  1. #1
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    Pipe Majors 4/5th Bn after WW2

    Can someone help me with the list of Pipe Majors of the 4/5th Bn Black Watch from 1946 to 1967?
    I do have some names, but when (year from-to) were they P/M:
    - Barron, Albert : 1946-1953 (born 1926 Monikie - died 1996 St. Andrews)
    - Carnegie, James : till 1956 (born 1911? - died 1984 Australia?)
    - Hanton, George Christie : 1950s? (born 1913? - died 1964 Stracathro)
    - McNicol, John : 1950s? (born 1913 Alloa - died 1988)
    - Ellis, Harry : 1950s? (born 1932 Dundee)
    - Duncan, Fred : 1960s? (born 1937?)
    I am also interested in their full first/middle names and year/place of birth.
    Your help will be appreciated.
    Thank you!
    Aad Boode
    Livingston
    email: aad@blueyonder.co.uk

  2. #2
    Administrator Chalky's Avatar
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    Hi Aad,

    I have looked through the Red Hackle Magazines and these are my findings.

    Any dates are the dates as they appeared in the RH.

    McNicol, John : 1950s? (born 1913 Alloa - died 1988)
    Mentioned as PM of the 4th in 1946. Next mention is Oct 49 as PM 4th/5th. Then July 50.

    There is a McNicol that was PM of the 2nd Battalion in 1947 who was mentioned as a recent arrival in the July 47 RH. In Oct 47 he is mentioned as 'Jock' McNicol. There was also a Jock McNicol in the 1st Bn. Is this the same man?

    Another name in 46 was 'Squeak' Ogilvie who was mentioned in the Sergeants Mess Notes in April 1946 and that is the only mention.

    The PM of the 5th at this time was Sinclair

    Barron, Albert : 1946-1953 (born 1926 Monikie - died 1996 St. Andrews)

    A piper Barron joined the 4/5th in Jan 50. Promoted to LCpl in Jul 51.
    Next mention is Jan 54 where Cpl Barron was appointed Caretaker at St Andrew's UTC. With this post he was appointed PM of the UTC.
    The next and last mention of Barron was as PM of the 4/5th in 1961

    Carnegie, James : till 1956 (born 1911? - died 1984 Australia?)

    Mentioned in Oct 47 as PM of 4/5th. Again in 48, 50, 51 (birth of son), 52 as PM with his Pipe Sgt being Sgt Hanton. Next is 54, then 55 where he relinquished his PM appointment to go to Oz.

    He later went to NZ to live and work for the NZ Electricity Department.



    Hanton, George Christie : 1950s? (born 1913? - died 1964 Stracathro)

    Took over PM in Jul 55 and resigned in 56 due to Job promotion.

    Rejoined the Band as PM in 1959 and composed 'Over the Capel to Birkhall


    Ellis, Harry : 1950s? (born 1932 Dundee)

    No mention in 50s, however there is a mention in 1963 on his promotion to PM.

    A new name for your list.
    In the Sgts Mess notes of Jan 63 it says we have lost PM Laird and congratulate PM Ellis on his promotion.

    PM Laird Mentioned as PM of 4/5th in Apr 62


    Duncan, Fred : 1960s? (born 1937?)

    Mentioned Jul 64 as PM. Transferred to the New Force in 66

  3. #3
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    The pipe major at the depot Queens bks in 1959-60 was Jock McNichol,probably waiting for demob. Bill...

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    Hi Chalky,
    Thank you for that information; you must have gone through a lot of Red Hackle Magazines! That is very kind of you.
    Based on your info the list for the 4/5th Bn could be as follows:
    - Carnegie : 1947-1949
    - McNicol : 1949-1950
    - Carnegie : 1950-1955
    - Hanton : 1955-1956
    - unknown : 1956-1959
    - Hanton : from 1959
    - Barron : 1961?
    - Laird : 1962-1963
    - Ellis : 1963-1964
    - Duncan : 1964-1966
    - unknown : 1966-1967.
    You mention Ogilvie in 1946; do you know if he was 4th or 4/5th Bn?
    If Barron was a Piper and Lcpl in 1950/51 he won't have been a P/M at that time (unless acting P/M).
    Any thoughts on the above are welcome.
    Thanks again.
    Aad

  5. #5
    Administrator Chalky's Avatar
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    The April 1946 Red Hackle lists Ogilvie as PM of the 4th Bn

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